Palamor Mointain
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Missy Krissy - 23 Dec 2007 04:21 GMT Yes.I am.No one knows but yes.I don't like the forest to be woken up.If they are not racing by Im fine.Repect our Proptey.Please.Private.Its like no other place in the world.Its palomar Mointain.Not a racing road.-thanks for bringing it up-A person who owns a lot up there.
Stephan Rose - 23 Dec 2007 15:26 GMT > Yes.I am.No one knows but yes.I don't like the forest to be woken up.If > they are not racing by Im fine.Repect our Proptey.Please.Private.Its > like no other place in the world.Its palomar Mointain.Not a racing > road.-thanks for bringing it up-A person who owns a lot up there. Well I suggest you go race to your nearest school and take a basic course in spelling and English grammar. You seem to severely need it!
 Signature Stephan 2003 Yamaha R6
君の事思い出す日なんてないのは 君の事忘れたときがないから
Buteo lineatus - 23 Dec 2007 16:45 GMT > > Yes.I am.No one knows but yes.I don't like the forest to be woken up.If > > they are not racing by Im fine.Repect our Proptey.Please.Private.Its [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Well I suggest you go race to your nearest school and take a basic course > in spelling and English grammar. You seem to severely need it! It could be a troll, or some property owner might really be pissed for good reason.
This story was written before a 60-year old woman on a motorcycle ran into a county truck and killed herself. She had been in a motorcycle accident on the road previously.
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/northcounty/20050925-9999-2m25moto.html
Sportriders race up and down South Grade Road and gather at Mother's Kitchen, which has traditionally been a stopping place for well- behaved touring riders.
The last time I visited Mother's, there was a list of rules posted prominently on the porch in front of the diner.
Motorcyclists were told not to hang out at Mother's after finishing their meal, not to move the outside furniture around, and not to hang around the ladies restroom.
TroytheTroll - 23 Dec 2007 18:32 GMT > Yes.I am.No one knows but yes.I don't like the forest to be woken > up.If they are not racing by Im fine.Repect our > Proptey.Please.Private.Its like no other place in the world.Its > palomar Mointain.Not a racing road.-thanks for bringing it up-A person > who owns a lot up there. Who are you? What is your story? And why is your first post here so incoherent?
Andrew - 23 Dec 2007 19:04 GMT > Yes.I am.No one knows but yes.I don't like the forest to be woken > up.If they are not racing by Im fine.Repect our > Proptey.Please.Private.Its like no other place in the world.Its > palomar Mointain.Not a racing road.-thanks for bringing it up-A person > who owns a lot up there I've ridden Palomar a few times, usually on an ultraglide classic. It seems like any other motorcycle road. Lots of sportbikes passed me, but that is to be expected.
 Signature Andrew 00 Daytona 00 Speed Triple 71 Kawi H1 05 Kiddo
Buteo lineatus - 23 Dec 2007 19:31 GMT On Dec 23, 11:04�am, "Andrew" <yogig.no.spamm.spam.n...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> I've ridden Palomar a few times, usually on an ultraglide classic. > It seems like any other motorcycle road. Local property owners would probably debate whether South Grade Road is a "motorcycle road" or a county road that exists for *their* use.
San Diego county officials would side with the property owners, as stakeholders on Palomar Mountain.
> Lots of sportbikes passed me, but that is to be expected. I was annoyed by a squid on a 600cc bike when I went to Palomar on my FZR1000.
I was going up the South Grade Road, he was coming down. He actually stopped, turned around, and started following me up.
I suspect the squid wanted a race. I didn't speed up, so he turned around and went back down the hill.
What an idiot.
P. Roehling - 23 Dec 2007 20:14 GMT >> I've ridden Palomar a few times, usually on an ultraglide classic. >> It seems like any other motorcycle road.
> Local property owners would probably debate whether South Grade Road is a "motorcycle road" or a county road that exists for *their* use.
Andrew's terminology may be unfortunate but there's no "debate" here at all: it's a public road, and that means it's open to bikers and property owners alike.
> San Diego county officials would side with the property owners, as stakeholders on Palomar Mountain.
Uh, you've personally polled them for thier opinions on this matter? I think not.
Andrew - 23 Dec 2007 21:25 GMT >>> I've ridden Palomar a few times, usually on an ultraglide classic. >>> It seems like any other motorcycle road. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > all: it's a public road, and that means it's open to bikers and property > owners alike. yeah I didn't mean to misconstrue 'motorcycle road' for 'public road.' It is a public road that is conducive to fun riding.
 Signature Andrew 00 Daytona 00 Speed Triple 71 Kawi H1 05 Kiddo
Buteo lineatus - 23 Dec 2007 23:16 GMT > > San Diego county officials would side with the property owners, as stakeholders on Palomar Mountain. > > Uh, you've personally polled them for thier opinions on this matter? I think > not. When push comes to shove *all* motorcycle riders will suffer, not just the squids. The cops have already tried to do a massive registration, license and insurance enforcement, they just didn't catch a lot of violators.
When was the last time you were able to "run" Ortega Highway?
P. Roehling - 24 Dec 2007 04:33 GMT > When push comes to shove *all* motorcycle riders will suffer, not just the squids.
So? Nobody here has said that they think Palomar should be used as a racetrack. You're beating a dead horse.
> The cops have already tried to do a massive registration, license and insurance enforcement, they just didn't catch a lot of violators.
Again, so? If the CHP can't stop the squids, it's a sure bet that *we* can't.
> When was the last time you were able to "run" Ortega Highway? I never "ran" Ortega Highway to begin with. When the urge to scrape my pegs becomes too strong, I book a track day ay Willow Springs or California Raceway.
That's what racetracks are *for*.
Buteo lineatus - 24 Dec 2007 06:55 GMT > So? Nobody here has said that they think Palomar should be used as a > racetrack. You're beating a dead horse. No, Andrew described Palomar as a "motorcycle road". When too many motorcycles use a road too often, there are always accidents and incidents and eventually the LEO's crack down on ALL riders, and the innocent get persecuted for what the squids did.
> > When was the last time you were able to "run" Ortega Highway? > > I never "ran" Ortega Highway to begin with. When the urge to scrape my pegs > becomes too strong, I book a track day ay Willow Springs or California > Raceway. But, don't you remember all the controversy over Ortega Highway, and the squid who used to brag in here about how wonderful it was to drag his knee on that road, and how some squids beat up a CHP with his own flashlight and how Ortega became a "safety corridor" with zero tolerance for speeding?
That's probably what will happen to Palomar, if law enforcement doesn't completely close the road to motorcycles. They can do that, in a county of a certain population density. As I recall, any county with about two million population can close a road to unwanted cruising.
P. Roehling - 24 Dec 2007 07:18 GMT > So? Nobody here has said that they think Palomar should be used as a > racetrack. You're beating a dead horse.
> No, Andrew described Palomar as a "motorcycle road". That doesn't mean "racetrack". It's just a beautiful road that naturally attracts motorcyclists, and this is not going to stop happening in the forseeable future, even if all the squids evaporated tomorrow morning.
Bobby O - 27 Dec 2007 16:09 GMT > > When push comes to shove *all* motorcycle riders will suffer, not just > > the squids. <snippity snip>
> I never "ran" Ortega Highway to begin with. When the urge to scrape my pegs > becomes too strong, I book a track day ay Willow Springs or California > Raceway. > > That's what racetracks are *for*. Amen brother.
No cars, no dogs, no curbs and you can focus on riding. Street squids tend to involve themselves in 'single vehicle accidents' and give the REST OF US a bad name. Like the Hardley Ableson (mostly) riders and their "loud pipes save lives" garbage.
And Prissey, it's a PUBLIC ROAD. Motorcyclists are part of THE PUBLIC and have just as much right to that road as any "land owner", period. You are entitled to your opinion just as motorcyclists are entitled to drive on public roadways. If rights are infringed upon by either you or the motorcyclists, then call the law enforcement agency appropriate for your area and explain how your rights have been infringed upon and let the law enforcement professionals do their job.
It's an old argument deserving of reasonable attention by both sides.
Oh, and if this guy who has been riding for almost 40 years offended someone, GOOD! Install a decent unoffensive exhaust system instead of making 'our' problem worse.
BobbyO
Noble Wolf - 27 Dec 2007 17:01 GMT > And Prissey, it's a PUBLIC ROAD. �Motorcyclists are part of THE PUBLIC > and have just as much right to that road as any "land owner", period. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > for your area and explain how your rights have been infringed upon and > let the law enforcement professionals do their job. When push comes to shove, law-abiding, well-behaved riders will lose the privilege of visiting Palomar mountain, while property owners will still have reasonable access.
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21100.htm
21100. Local authorities may adopt rules and regulations by ordinance or resolution regarding the following matters:
(a) Regulating or prohibiting processions or assemblages on the highways.
k) (1) Regulating cruising.
(2) The ordinance or resolution adopted pursuant to this subdivision shall regulate cruising, which ( )4 is the repetitive driving of a motor vehicle past a traffic control point in traffic ( )5 that is congested at or near the traffic control point, as determined by the ranking peace officer on duty within the affected area, within a specified time period and after the vehicle operator has been given an adequate written notice that further driving past the control point will be a violation of the ordinance or resolution. ( )6
(3) A person is not in violation of an ordinance or resolution adopted pursuant to this subdivision unless both of the following apply:
(A) That person has been given the written notice on a previous driving trip past the control point and then again passes the control point in that same time interval.
(B) The beginning and end of the portion of the street subject to cruising controls are clearly identified by signs that briefly and clearly state the appropriate provisions of this subdivision and the local ordinance or resolution on cruising.
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21101.htm
Regulation of Highways 21101. Local authorities, for those highways under their jurisdiction, may adopt rules and regulations by ordinance or resolution on the following matters:
(a) Closing any highway to vehicular traffic when, in the opinion of the legislative body having jurisdiction, the highway is either of the following:
(1) No longer needed for vehicular traffic.
(2) The closure is in the interests of public safety and all of the following conditions and requirements are met:
(A) The street proposed for closure is located in a county with a population of 6,000,000 or more.
(B) The street has an unsafe volume of traffic and a significant incidence of crime.
(C) The affected local authority conducts a public hearing on the proposed street closure.
(D) Notice of the hearing is provided to residents and owners of property adjacent to the street proposed for closure.
(E) The local authority makes a finding that closure of the street likely would result in a reduced rate of crime.
(b) Designating any highway as a through highway and requiring that all vehicles observe official traffic control devices before entering or crossing the highway or designating any intersection as a stop intersection and requiring all vehicles to stop at one or more entrances to the intersection.
(c) Prohibiting the use of particular highways by certain vehicles, except as otherwise provided by the Public Utilities Commission pursuant to Article 2 (commencing with Section 1031) of Chapter 5 of Part 1 of Division 1 of the Public Utilities Code.
(d) Closing particular streets during regular school hours for the purpose of conducting automobile driver training programs in the secondary schools and colleges of this state.
(e) Temporarily closing a portion of any street for celebrations, parades, local special events, and other purposes when, in the opinion of local authorities having jurisdiction or a public officer or employee that the local authority designates by resolution, the closing is necessary for the safety and protection of persons who are to use that portion of the street during the temporary closing.
(f) Prohibiting entry to, or exit from, or both, from any street by means of islands, curbs, traffic barriers, or other roadway design features to implement the circulation element of a general plan adopted pursuant to Article 6 (commencing with Section 65350) of Chapter 3 of Division 1 of Title 7 of the Government Code. The rules and regulations authorized by this subdivision shall be consistent with the responsibility of local government to provide for the health and safety of its citizens.
Amended Sec. 63.5, Ch. 877, Stats. 1998. Effective January 1, 1999. Supersedes Ch. 876.
Bob Nixon - 24 Dec 2007 02:57 GMT > Yes.I am.No one knows but yes.I don't like the forest to be woken > up.If they are not racing by Im fine.Repect our > Proptey.Please.Private.Its like no other place in the world.Its > palomar Mointain.Not a racing road.-thanks for bringing it up-A person > who owns a lot up there. Here are my thoughs to yout problem Miss Missy Krissy. California's near 40 million population is to be blamed and landowning policies in your own pristine wilderness erea's. In Arizona right next door, we don't let people buy property in national forest lands, except grandfathered properties which are very few. Also the many Indian reservation lands don't allow for the "white eyes" building houses on there land. Our own local set of four lakes Surarro, Canyon, Apache & Rosevelt along the Apahce trail only house the lake's and road caretakers with the lone excepttion of the tourist town of Tortilla flats that has been around since the building of Rosevlt Dam around 1916. Other Lakes and wildernes area's near Phoenix, Tucson, Flagstaff, Payson, Prescott, Yuma & other Towns are all set up to maximize wilderness area's such as Oak Creek Canyon near Sedona or the Coronado trail in Eastern AZ. Yes we have less people than Kalifornia but most of the land outside of the cities is public owned and you cannot homestead or buy property there.
Now put that in your cake and eat it little pissy, Missie.
Bob Nixon RZ-350, SV-650, Chandler AZ.
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