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Motorcycle Forum / General / Technical / May 2004cam/valve train removal on ex 250 ninja
no manual here; any trick/procedure for easier removal of head on 250 ninja; have not previously dealt with automatic cam tensioner, so am guessing it has to be removed first... tia >From: "dogalone" dogalone@hotmail.com >no manual here; Then *don't* take it apart until you get a manual!!!! >any trick/procedure for easier removal of head on 250 ninja; The "trick" is to *read the friggin' manual"! Then read it again, and read it over, if you're unsure of what you are doing. And, don't trust Haynes manuals, they are notoriously wrong. A Kawasaki shop manual that costs $40 or $50 is a cheap investment, compared to buying expen$ive replacement parts to fix what you buggered my not understanding what you're doing... If you break one of the cam bearing caps because you don't know what you're doing, you may wind up buying a whole new cylinder head for $$$$ from Kawasaki or buying a used one for half that amount from a motorcycle salvage yard. The cam bearing caps are line-bored with the cylinder head, so you can't just expect to go buy a cam bearing cap and bolt it onto the existing head. A machinist would have to line bore it for you, and, how many competent machinists do you know? >have not previously dealt with automatic cam tensioner, so am guessing it has to be removed first... Before you remove the cam chain tensioner, turn the engine to top dead center on the compression stroke of #1 cylinder. Hint: all the valves on #1 cylinder will have clearance with the tappets, the other cylinder should have one valve partly open... After you get the #1 cylinder to TDC, then you can remove the automatic chain tensioner, and it will be the last thing you put back in, after reinstalling the cams and torquing down the bearing caps... But, how in the heck will you know where the camshaft timing marks are, and how much torque to use on the bearing caps, and how will you know what to lubricate the cam bearings with, if you have no manual? Buy a manual... >no manual here; >any trick/procedure for easier removal of head on 250 ninja; >have not previously dealt with automatic cam tensioner, so am guessing it >has to be removed first... > >tia If you're puzzled about how to get something this basic apart, you need a manual. You'll especially need it if you intend to put it together again. One thing I've learned in my 30 odd years, amateur and professional, at working on bikes is; if available, get the manual. Bill Smith some very good points here (cam caps being engine specifc, take adjuster off first, establish some kind of marking for aligning cams on re-assembly, and; get a manual); the original post was directed towards someone with a manual who would happen to have the specs, and the where-with-all to advise someone without am guessing the torque values on the cam caps to be in the 10# range; now if i can just get away with using the old head gasket... thanks!! > some very good points here (cam caps being engine specifc, take adjuster off > first, establish some kind of marking for aligning cams on re-assembly, and; [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > am guessing the torque values on the cam caps to be in the 10# range; now if > i can just get away with using the old head gasket... I happen to have the manual and the supplement for this bike. I wouldn't mind looking up a particular torque value or something along those lines. What I won't do is handhold someone through the entire process, because it would be time consuming to type it out, and you won't be getting all the applicable procedures, which are scattered throughout the manual sections and also in the supplement for the later model variants. You *need* to buy the manuals before taking the cylinder head off, trust me. This is by far the best advice you are going to get. Going at this sort of work without a manual is idiocy. I bought the manuals from http://www.ronayers.com, they are pretty good on price: Part Number: 99924-1066-01 Description: Service Manual EX250E Price: $28.82 Part Number: 99924-1109-60 Description: Service Manual Supplement EX250 Price: $19.46  SignatureMark '01 SV650S '99 EX250-F13 '81 CM400T now if >i can just get away with using the old head gasket... You can't. Buy a manual. > now if i can just get away with using the old head gasket... >From: acrispycritter@hotmail.com (Burnout) >You can't. Depends on what the head gasket is made of. I had a Yamaha 2-stroke dirt bike that had a solid copper gasket. It could be annealed in the oven, softening it, and then re-used... But crushable steel gaskets can't be re-used, they are a one-time deal... >> now if i can just get away with using the old head gasket... > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >But crushable steel gaskets can't be re-used, they are a one-time deal... It's not copper and not reusable. And he still needs a manual. and i thought i was kidding about the head gasket.... remembering that Permatex race car (circa late '60s) that was put together without even one gasket?? will keep you posted on the progress/thanks (again, but not in advance) please don't feed the trolls!!! > and i thought i was kidding about the head gasket.... > > remembering that Permatex race car (circa late '60s) that was put together > without even one gasket?? > > will keep you posted on the progress/thanks (again, but not in advance) Did anyone mention that before he cracks the case on his motor, he might want to look into getting a manual? :) I tend to help folks out on a website for SR250s and even with an "on-line" manual, I keep having to repeat the phrase "Look at the manual". Can anyone 'splain what I'm missing here? > please don't feed the trolls!!! > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > > > will keep you posted on the progress/thanks (again, but not in advance) He's been nicely urged by several to get a manual, but he is too smart/cute to do so. In the words of the immortal Dan Tanner "it's going to cost $5 to fix what's wrong and $500.00 to fix what you f.cked up trying to fix it......" > Did anyone mention that before he cracks the case on his motor, he might > want to look into getting a manual? :) [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > > > > > will keep you posted on the progress/thanks (again, but not in advance) buy the manual, or steal it. there's nothing tricky about the job but screw it up and you'll wish you had bought the manual. the 250 ninja is a sweet little bike. i enjoyed mine. my ninjas came in baskets. worked out well. good luck, sammm Signaturetoys: diesel BMW motorcycle, homebuilt electric motorcycle, gold wing trike, honda gyros, dodge diesel dualie, fiat osca 1500 cabriolet, W3CYO/R, 145.49, 224.40, 443.300 mhz. repeaters. > no manual here; > any trick/procedure for easier removal of head on 250 ninja; > have not previously dealt with automatic cam tensioner, so am guessing it > has to be removed first... > > tia yeah; well to get the head into the shop (my first ninja 250 has me thousand out of pocket only to find that it is on the verge of sucking the #1 intake), i'm hoping the online parts diagram will be enough (for example, wouldn't want to make the mistake of not taking the complete tensioner off as an assemby) well had little trouble using common mechanical practice on the tear down; now need the expected torque values and sequence for putting the cams & head back on. > no manual here; > any trick/procedure for easier removal of head on 250 ninja; > have not previously dealt with automatic cam tensioner, so am guessing it > has to be removed first... > > tia try not to mix up the bolts. some are different lengths. the basket cases i restored had stripped threads from the mixup. good luck, samm Signaturetoys: diesel BMW motorcycle, homebuilt electric motorcycle, gold wing trike, honda gyros, dodge diesel dualie, fiat osca 1500 cabriolet, W3CYO/R, 145.49, 224.40, 443.300 mhz. repeaters. > well had little trouble using common mechanical practice on the tear down; > now need the expected torque values and sequence for putting the cams & head [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > > > tia okay, well went with about 25 #'s on head torque, cold; couldn't make heads/tails out of how in the world you would torque it warm (i see now somewhere between 1.2 to 2 kg m); and am still guessing as to the cam caps. found a pretty cool site ( http://www.ninja250.com ) , but have never seen cams settings based on other than marks or pointing directly each other > no manual here; > any trick/procedure for easier removal of head on 250 ninja; > have not previously dealt with automatic cam tensioner, so am guessing it > has to be removed first... > > tia |
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