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Motorcycle Forum / Country Specific / UK Group / April 2008Have we seen this before?
New type of engine valvgear... http://www.coatesengine.com/technology.html And in a bike: http://www.coatesengine.com/motorcycle.html  SignatureFr. Jack The ex(un)civil servant > New type of engine valvgear... > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > http://www.coatesengine.com/motorcycle.html How's that work then? With a poppet valve a greater or lesser amount of fuel/air mixture can be pushed past the valve as and when, but that rotary valve must contain a finite amount of mixture... Perhaps I should read more of the website? SignatureSi - XV535 "Mungo \"Two Sheds\" Toadfoot" <eastREMOVEkent@gmail.com> gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying: > How's that work then? With a poppet valve a greater or lesser amount of > fuel/air mixture can be pushed past the valve as and when, but that > rotary valve must contain a finite amount of mixture... Think about an electrical junction box, rotating the lid so two of the "ports" are open simultaneously... The head is the body of the JB, with one port into the chamber, the other to the manifold whilst the lid is the rotary valve. Or something. > "Mungo \"Two Sheds\" Toadfoot" <eastREMOVEkent@gmail.com> gurgled > happily, sounding much like they were saying: [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Or something. Got it. Derrrrrrrrrrrrrr :) SignatureSi - XV535 > > New type of engine valvgear... > > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > of fuel/air mixture can be pushed past the valve as and when, but > that rotary valve must contain a finite amount of mixture... I'm constantly surprised by peoples' inability to see the obvious. >>> New type of engine valvgear... >>> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > I'm constantly surprised by peoples' inability to see the obvious. Fack orf, cahhhhhhhhnt. SignatureSi - XV535 On Apr 29, 9:50 pm, "Mungo \"Two Sheds\" Toadfoot" <eastREMOVEk...@gmail.com> wrote: > >>> New type of engine valvgear... > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Fack orf, cahhhhhhhhnt. I'm glad reasoned discourse isn't dead on here .. P. > New type of engine valvgear... > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > http://www.coatesengine.com/motorcycle.html Yes mate, here:- http://www.peraves.ch/ SignatureI don't care to belong to a club that accepts people like me as members. Groucho Marx >> New type of engine valvgear... >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >http://www.peraves.ch/ Err, no that's rather like a wankel engine; my link is a conventional piston engine, with the cams replaced bt the new fangled valves... SignatureFr. Jack The ex(un)civil servant >>> New type of engine valvgear... >>> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Err, no that's rather like a wankel engine; my link is a conventional > piston engine, with the cams replaced bt the new fangled valves... Is it too late to say no? I f.cking hate Shiraz me, it causes excess stupidity in silly old bastards. SignatureI don't care to belong to a club that accepts people like me as members. Groucho Marx > New type of engine valvgear... > > http://www.coatesengine.com/technology.html They've pluralised 'RPM', ffs, I wouldn't buy an adjustable spanner off them. >> New type of engine valvgear... >> >> http://www.coatesengine.com/technology.html > >They've pluralised 'RPM', ffs, I wouldn't buy an adjustable spanner off >them. And refers to 'intake cycles' and the like. Signature-Pip >> New type of engine valvgear... >> >> http://www.coatesengine.com/technology.html > > They've pluralised 'RPM', ffs, I wouldn't buy an adjustable spanner off > them. And they have ignotion too. SignatureBeav VN 750 Zed 1000 OMF# 19 >And they have ignotion too. That's when the ignition doesn't work... SignatureFr. Jack The ex(un)civil servant >New type of engine valvgear... > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >http://www.coatesengine.com/motorcycle.html OK, this is what I spotted: 1) If the spherical valves don't need lubricants because of the 'special materials', then why can't these same materials be used on a conventional engine? 2) Claim: 'Poppet valves can't open before TDC'. Utter bollocks. 3) Claim: 'Poppet valve engines almost always exceed a temperature of 2,500 degrees F which in turn, at such high temperatures, produce oxides of nitrogen'. Well if he's referring to combustion temperature, true up to a point but high max. gas temperature == high thermodynamic efficiency. Besides which, what makes the balls engine '*combustion* temperatures lower? 4) Somehow the balls engine is multi fuel capable, yet conventional valved engines are not. To be fair, he does say it reduces hotspots and thus allows a higher CR or lower octane rating. 5) Claim: 'Conventional engines lose power through friction and pumping. The spherical rotary valve assembly virtually eliminates engine friction and pumping losses'. So it doesn't pump mixture in or exhaust gases out, then? 6) ...actually, I'm bored now. The sheer amount of bullshit puts me off bothering further. Signature-Pip >>New type of engine valvgear... >> [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > efficiency. Besides which, what makes the balls engine '*combustion* > temperatures lower? Presumably because as the ball valve rotates, it's subjected to cooling air, probably from the nice cold air coming into the motor from the outside world. Perfect for those engines that run well on hot air as opposed to the engines we know that love cold air. > 4) Somehow the balls engine is multi fuel capable, yet conventional > valved engines are not. To be fair, he does say it reduces hotspots > and thus allows a higher CR or lower octane rating. He could be thinking about engines from the 80's that needed lead in the fuel. He obviously doesn't know about lead free stuff, or it can't be bought in leftpondia. > 5) Claim: 'Conventional engines lose power through friction and > pumping. The spherical rotary valve assembly virtually eliminates > engine friction and pumping losses'. So it doesn't pump mixture in or > exhaust gases out, then? Does ANY engine pump mixture in (apart from a turbo or supercharged engine?) Fuel is pumped, but the air it mixes with isn't. Not that it makes any diff, because the valves themselves don't affect how the air/mixture reaches them. > 6) ...actually, I'm bored now. The sheer amount of bullshit puts me > off bothering further. Have you watched and listened) to the video. It's lauhable what sound it makes. SignatureBeav VN 750 Zed 1000 OMF# 19 >> 5) Claim: 'Conventional engines lose power through friction and >> pumping. The spherical rotary valve assembly virtually eliminates >> engine friction and pumping losses'. So it doesn't pump mixture in or >> exhaust gases out, then? > >Does ANY engine pump mixture in (apart from a turbo or supercharged engine?) Well, yes; the whole engine is a pump. It has to draw mixture (or air if DI) in through an intake system. I'm not saying that the ball valves in themselves would necessarily be a bad idea, but the exaggerated claims and bullshit kind of swamp any useful information he presents. Signature-Pip >>> 5) Claim: 'Conventional engines lose power through friction and >>> pumping. The spherical rotary valve assembly virtually eliminates [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Well, yes; the whole engine is a pump. It has to draw mixture (or air > if DI) in through an intake system. > I'm not saying that the ball valves in themselves would necessarily be > a bad idea, but the exaggerated claims and bullshit kind of swamp any > useful information he presents. What these guys do is sit down and draw up a list of "features and benfits". Once they run out of REAL features and TRUE benefits, they're so giddy, they can't f.cking stop yakking and writing. We see the reuslts in these wild-as-f.ck claims. SignatureBeav VN 750 Zed 1000 OMF# 19 > New type of engine valvgear... > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > http://www.coatesengine.com/motorcycle.html The bikes look remarkably like a Harley Softail and the engine crankcase and primary I would say without doubt are from HD! Interesting technology though. Will it catch on? SignatureGreybeard FLHR -03 UK (95 cu-in Stg 2. Big Boy2!) Trumpet Trophy 1200-03 Garmin Zumo 550, To get me home! ukrm@foxtails[dot]co[dot]uk >> New type of engine valvgear... >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >primary I would say without doubt are from HD! >Interesting technology though. I was pleased to read Pip L's comments, as I'd thought of several of them myself, but wasn't sure, not being an engineer, like. >Will it catch on? Naah. Direct injection's the way forward. Covers many of the claims this one makes, but at a much more detailed level, IYSWIM. Oh, and it's already out there working on hundreds[1] of thousands of cars. [1] Tens, perhaps. Been in use by Mitsubushi and VW that I knowof for a few years now, anyway. Signature_______ .'_/_|_\_'. Ace (b.rogers at ifrance.com) \`\ | /`/ `\\ | //' BOTAFOT#3, SbS#2, UKRMMA#13, DFV#8, SKA#2, IBB#10 `\|/` ` >I was pleased to read Pip L's comments, as I'd thought of several of >them myself, but wasn't sure, not being an engineer, like. Ah, well I was pleased that you'd thought of them too, not being an engineer myself, like! Signature-Pip Fr Jack <sp@m.com> wrote; >New type of engine valvgear... It's a Cross rotary, but one for each port. A double-Cross? SignatureDenis SprintST1050 Tiger750TR7RV > New type of engine valvgear... > > http://www.coatesengine.com/technology.html Interesting arrangement and if it's as good as they make out, it'll probably be more common than the Wankel engine. Changing people's minds about the conventional valve engine isn't going to be easy though. > And in a bike: > > http://www.coatesengine.com/motorcycle.html When you say "bike", I assume you're taking the piss. It sounds like a bunch of aliens being squeezed between two dump trucks too. Must be a shite sound recording. SignatureBeav VN 750 Zed 1000 OMF# 19 > New type of engine valvgear... > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > http://www.coatesengine.com/motorcycle.html Not dissimilar to a sleeve valve. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleeve_valve >> New type of engine valvgear... >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleeve_valve I did some reasonably advanced designs for a rotary valve engine while at the AEA. Limitations (at the time) were finance to produce and the sealing materials. I'd rather see an advanced 2-T design come along TBH and I love the new Mazda rotary as per the RX-8. SignatureHog '03 ST4S '96 Bastard12 '89 R100RS '81 XS650 '78 RD400 We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember Fr Jack <sp@m.com> saying something like: >New type of engine valvgear... > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >http://www.coatesengine.com/motorcycle.html They make all sorts of dubious claims, imo. "The spherical rotary valve assembly virtually eliminates engine friction and pumping losses." This is a pile of donkey dung. Many other words and phrases are in the text that makes me wonder just who wrote it. SignatureDave GS850x2 XS650 SE6a "It's a moron working with power tools. How much more suspenseful can you get?" - House >We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the >drugs began to take hold. I remember Fr Jack <sp@m.com> saying something [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >"The spherical rotary valve assembly virtually eliminates engine >friction and pumping losses." This is a pile of donkey dung. Christ, isn't it. How can different valvegear affect pumping losses from the pistons going up and down? SignatureChamp ZX10R | GPz750turbo | GSX-R 600 racer My advice as your attorney is to buy a motorcycle To email me, neal at my domain should work. >> We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the >> drugs began to take hold. I remember Fr Jack <sp@m.com> saying [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > Christ, isn't it. How can different valvegear affect pumping losses > from the pistons going up and down? I expect they mean within the cylinder head. Don't F1 engines run crankcases at very low air pressure for such reasons? Anyway, a nice desmo does the job. SignatureHog '03 ST4S '96 Bastard12 '89 R100RS '81 XS650 '78 RD400 |
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